In the closing hours of our online poll, 74 respondents have voted so far, with 67% saying they don't expect a message from Gurumayi to be the advertised "sweet surprise" in store for the 2008 New Year's Message.
If you haven't yet cast your vote, this is your last chance. Poll closes at the stroke of midnight, EST. The poll can be found on the right hand margin of "Rituals" homepage.
I promise to reveal what the surprise actually was, as soon as I can persuade someone who spent $100 to hear it, to tell it to me for free.
Happy New Year, everyone. Thanks for coming along for the ride!
SEEKHER
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25 comments:
The "sweet surprise" has already occurred in New Zealand and Australia, and I am anonymously in one of those countries, but I was unable to attend... I am just wondering....
OK, I'm the Aust/NZ person, and YES, I HAVE HEARD IT IS THE REAL GURU IN AUDIO PERSON!!! So maybe that will shut up some of the mockers.
... and not just for 5 minutes, but for the WHOLE SATSANG! Hey, I shouldn't be telling you this. It is supposed to be a surprise! :)
Trust me,this IS a surprise!
"The Master doesn't talk, he acts.
His words are in perfect harmony with his actions. He is always genuine.
~Tao Te Ching
It matters not that she spoke for 5 minutes or 5 hours, with the daily thrashing she's getting in cyberspace she needs to do SOMETHING to save the "cha-ching$"
Too little, too late.
I like your blog because it is witty and fun (although somewhat sarcastic)... however some of the comments left by people are just parroted LSY stuff and brainwashed bitterness. I'm not posting here anymore.
There is a new message for the year too. It is a positive reminder. No point posting it here - someone will find something negative in it, for sure, as they always manage to do.
Goodbye. Nice "knowing" you.
It means little to me of GM comes or goes to her community's New Year celebration. If some comes, it will be more of he same, ever since January of 2005. If not that will also be more of the same.
The real test will come after the satsang is over. That test will be in the minds and in the hearts of the entire SY movement, its leader included.
I think SY failed a crucial test in the wake of the New Yorker article. It's a simple test - do you tell the truth about yourself or do you keep on telling lies?
The story about Muktananda features some HUGE lies. Those are the ones that built the foundations of SY and they are the ones that will most likely guide his remaining devotees in 2008.
And a Happy New Year to all of you too.
K.
Abhaya said...
"The Master doesn't talk, he acts.
His words are in perfect harmony with his actions. He is always genuine.
~Tao Te Ching
--
Amen to that.
Won't shut up this mocker.
She lost me several years ago.
What really irks me is the whole "Hey, I shouldn't be telling you this" routine from SY."
Too much secrecy for my tastes.
I will give her this: I'm indeed surprised she didn't maximize they money take to the hilt by making sure everyone knew her pre-recorded program was a key part of the show. Who knows. Maybe she's reached a point where she feels she's earned enough.
I'm still dismayed at the number of people who allow themselves to be strung along.
Is this mockery disturbing?
Or perhaps hitting a nerve?
"I like your blog because it is witty and fun (although somewhat sarcastic)... however some of the comments left by people are just parroted LSY stuff and brainwashed bitterness. I'm not posting here anymore.
There is a new message for the year too. It is a positive reminder. No point posting it here - someone will find something negative in it, for sure, as they always manage to do. Goodbye. Nice "knowing" you.
January 1, 2008 5:33 AM"
(sigh....)
Yet another one re-hoodwinked.
People want their guru fix so badly, they're willing to just dive right back in just because someone came out of hiding. Or at least, their pre-recorded voice came out of hiding.
Introspection by this writer revealed his own deep, long-term need for "fixes" of shakti, of devotion, of thinking everything was alright.
And then it hit me that I was addicted. Unable to control my craving for a shakti hit, for a devotional swoon. The yearning was so intense.
Except I was able to somehow see an internal need to no longer be at its beck and call. I needed the ability say "no" and not have my independence compromised anymore.
And THAT...THAT was the chink in the armor of my SY universe that caused the entire thing to fracture.
Three years later, I still don't miss the dependency. I'd much rather take that $100 to pay off a little more of my holiday credit card spending.
I am anxiously following this thread. I came upon Siddha Yoga AFTER Gurumayi's disappearance. I ran across a used book that she wrote in Half Price Books. (The Yoga of Discipline). As I read that book I felt like everything I had known to be true my entire life but hadn't been able to articulate was FINALLY on paper. When I started googling her to find out more I found out about the controversy. It's sad - but, it didn't change the fact that I wanted to read and hear every word she ever said. I bought all the books, CDs, and have every Darshan magazine I've been able to find on E-bay in the last 2 years. I guess my point is ... for me, she's never been "here", but her influence on me is strong and positive. I'd like for everyone who is sad at "losing her" to know that she's still a light to people who are just discovering her (even by accident). I'll be thrilled if she does give the talk today! Namaste.
I feel compelled to comment after the last one I read.
I had seen Gurumayi only twice briefly in real life, so I related to the experience of her through talks and books. I too bought just about every book and CD, and for awhile just dove into them. Later on I similarly heard the negative rumors. I then decided to measure that against my actual experience, which has been really nice.
It is tough to hear that stuff after this took such a part in my heart.
It has left me a little unclear as of now, which I suppose is 'OK'.
But I definitely feel something in the her words and presence that I don't feel elsewhere, so there I am.
Surprisingly she showed.
I really don't envy Gurumayi. Even with all of her mistakes I don't think she really had the best chance in life to become a person of integrity. I mean with mentors such as Muktananda.
Just like the last post, I never got too involved in SY but from contact with some of the teachings (for want of a better word) I have had good experiences.
SY was the first place that told me what I alway knew but had forgotten that I am part of the divine and the "self" is splendid. My prior exposure to religion when I was a child seemed cruel and cold...like I am a sinner.
I didn't believe Gurumayi was anything other than a human playing a public role. I think this has helped me not to get too involved in an unhealthy way.
I hope all those people who were hurt by SY find healing.
I want them to know that the things they experienced aren't just limited to SY. I was involved in a Tibetan Buddhist group once and it was really strange and controlling. It was potentially quite head f*&&ing. The same things were done, like if you had a problem with the status quo it was your problem and your projection. You were constantly told not to trust your own mind. The tibetan nun (equivilent to guru) was abusive in some respects and this was justified by the tradition that the guru is performing ego eradicating tactics and also doing things to trigger you into your stuff so you can explore it.
In one way I can see this is potentially helpful...but really it is confusing and abusive and doesn't leave those in charge accountable at all.
Happy new year. Marta you are courageous...you will find you answers, no doubt as all of us will.
I think the SY experience is reminiscent of many others. The world is a mixed up place and the most important thing is to find your own centre so you don't get mixed up in it.
Re: "Except I was able to somehow see an internal need to no longer be at its beck and call. I needed the ability say "no" and not have my independence compromised anymore.
And THAT...THAT was the chink in the armor of my SY universe that caused the entire thing to fracture.
Three years later, I still don't miss the dependency. I'd much rather take that $100 to pay off a little more of my holiday credit card spending.
January 1, 2008 11:27 AM
Thanks Anon. This was the chink in the armour for me or maybe the beginning of real armour, protection from the predation. Yes, feels good to have oneself back. Your post made this new growth real for me.
"I then decided to measure that against my actual experience, which has been really nice."
I'm not sure if this crosses over into the oft-quoted (by SY'ers still quite firmly "in" SY) phrase "It's not my experience."
Which translates to me into: "Others claim Muktananda or Gurumayi abused them in some way. I haven't experienced that, so I choose instead to disbelieve it. Maybe they're lying or have an axe to grind."
Genocide isn't my experience either, but it has undeniably happened and is happening now (Darfur, for example.) Does my not experiencing it mean I should turn a blind eye toward those who were victimized...or minimize their victimization?
I have friends who were such SY victims. In the most extreme cases, sexual abuse. In nearly as extreme cases, physical abuse (violent). In other cases, verbal abuse. In other cases, what I would term financial abuse.
Carried out not just by senior teachers in SYDA, but by the "Gurus" themselves.
This is also part of SY. Ignoring it and "not throwing out the baby with the bathwater", hoping to extract the positive from SY and yet leave the negative alone, to me equates to only seeing what one is comfortable with seeing and denying that is which hurtful and uncomfortable to acknowledge.
This denigrates, by pure default if not by overt intention, the pain experienced by the victims of SY. It also is equivalent to only accepting part of the whole spectrum of what constitutes SY and its history.
The United States of America is responsible for both incredibly wonderful contributions to the world and also horrific, awful ones. Should one be looked at to the exclusion of the other? Or, should the whole be looked at realistically? The same goes for SY and its history.
I once myself used that line of thinking, of "It's not my experience" to justify my continued involvement with SY. Deep involvement. For nearly 25 years. When I found out that friends of mine were among the victims from both Muktananda's era and Chidvilasananda's era, it hit home. HARD. I realized that I could no longer ignore the damage suffered by many, and felt guilty that I was an unwitting contributor to it through my seva, my dakshina, my continued support and presence. I made a conscious choice not to ignore that suffering, and decided to take a stand against it by leaving SY and withdrawing that support.
I cannot allow myself to long for a Guru who has committed acts of pain as well as acts of seeming spirituality. I choose for myself the continued search for a spiritual teacher who really embodies the lofty goals of what a truly humble, wise, enlightened spiritual master is supposed to be about. For me, Baba and Gurumayi have both failed that test and are each no longer deserving of MY devotion. "Shaktipat" or none. If my shaktipat was possible due to the pain suffered by my friends and others, then I truly wish I could take it all back and find a way to ease the suffering of the victims.
He Shri Hari, I pray those who suffered under SY do indeed experience healing and closure in this very lifetime.
Hari Om Tat Sat
"Thanks Anon. This was the chink in the armour for me or maybe the beginning of real armour, protection from the predation. Yes, feels good to have oneself back. Your post made this new growth real for me.
January 1, 2008 6:19 PM"
No thanks necessary. Simply telling my own story.
What is truly incredible to me, now that I have SY in my rearview, is just how addicted I was to feeling that swoon of devotion, of wanting to just humble myself and pranam at her feet (and his feet before her, and yes, I got shaktipat from him in the early eighties). I just needed that hit of shakti, either via darshan, meditation, chanting, seva, other practices.
I simply realized it was just as much an addiction as anything else, whether to drugs, alcohol, food, sex, gambling, whatever. Something that had mastery over ME, rather than my having mastery over IT.
And a newfound desire to not be enslaved by that craving of the swoon, that shakti hit, was the beginning of a newfound independence.
Lord Gautama Buddha, Esteemed Shakyamuni, said to follow the middle path, to not be overly ascetic nor be overly induldgent. I realized after a time that the addiction to SY was in fact indulgence. Realizing this truly helped me to step away from SY.
Sorry to upset all you folks who are so happy to hear Chid's voice today, but I have to express my voice here: I was addicted to Siddha Yoga. I am happy to be free of that addiction. I am now free to be me, engaged in that middle path.
And so I feel compelled to voice a challenge: I believe I was addicted to SY. Are you folks who are so happy to have heard her pre-recorded voice today so, SO TOTALLY sure, that you are NOT addicted? And do you TRULY wish to hand over your mastery of your own self, your own life to someone else, to someTHING else?
I hope you'll all at least spend some time thinking about it.
"I'm not sure if this crosses over into the oft-quoted (by SY'ers still quite firmly "in" SY) phrase "It's not my experience."
Which translates to me into: "Others claim Muktananda or Gurumayi abused them in some way. I haven't experienced that, so I choose instead to disbelieve it. Maybe they're lying or have an axe to grind."
I choose for myself the continued search for a spiritual teacher who really embodies the lofty goals of what a truly humble, wise, enlightened spiritual master is supposed to be about. "
Yes I suppose "it's not my experience " is what I'm saying,
and I suppose were I to have direct friends , as you have, tell me this stuff, it would have the impact on me it has on you.
It's tough to digest all that , when I see all that Siddha Yoga is now, with all the people at my local center who seem so authentic etc.
Were I to have the conviction through direct experience , as you, with all this, I don't know if I would even have the belief in a true guru etc. , for my whole belief in it was developed largely in there.
That whole concept is so traumatic to think of.
I'm sure I will know the truth one day for myself, not to doubt your testimony, but you certainly waged your knowing upon your experience, as am I.
No, I don't believe in the concept of true guru anymore. What Muktananda and Chidvilasananda have done tore that concept apart for me.
You said "That whole concept is so traumatic to think of.
I'm sure I will know the truth one day for myself, not to doubt your testimony, but you certainly waged your knowing upon your experience, as am I."
At this point, I'm dropping this subject with you. I can see it's become nothing more than a pointless debate, which is a waste of my energy. You've clearly stated you're not ready to accept the other half of the equation.
Even having gone through it myself, I sure wish I understood how SY generates such deep denial.
>>>Lord Gautama Buddha, Esteemed Shakyamuni, said to follow the middle path, to not be overly ascetic nor be overly induldgent. I realized after a time that the addiction to SY was in fact indulgence. Realizing this truly helped me to step away from SY."<<<
the Buddha (awakened one) also said....test EVERYTHING yourself and do NOT accept things "by rote"...and, "if you meet the Buddha, kill him" (meaning...don't substitite
"Lord" buddha for some other deity...we are ALL Buddha!)
Anonymous January 2, 2008 11:03 AM , you are misquoting.
You said "the Buddha (awakened one) also said....test EVERYTHING yourself and do NOT accept things "by rote"...and, "if you meet the Buddha, kill him" (meaning...don't substitite
"Lord" buddha for some other deity...we are ALL Buddha!)"
Get your facts straight. It was not Siddhartha Gautama who said this, it was the 9th century Chinese zen (Ch'an in Chinese)
monk Lin Chi. His point was to not accept anything religious on faith but instead to test, test, test everything first. Which I wholeheartedly agree with.
Source:
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=1785326
>>"Get your facts straight. It was not Siddhartha Gautama who said this, it was the 9th century Chinese zen (Ch'an in Chinese)
monk Lin Chi. His point was to not accept anything religious on faith but instead to test, test, test everything first. Which I wholeheartedly agree with."<<<
Whoops! you're right...I combined two sources for the same basic principle..that buddhism isn't really "about" setting up another "Lord". In the context of this conversation, that was what I was alluding to. thanks for the correction,
Ranting Space
Forgive me. The thought that for $100USD I could see Gurumayi say a few words has me considering signing in. I would read more into it all. Yet listening would show me how far I have come away from following a single person as my spiritual guide. You here are all my guides.
Still, I was so recetnly still enamored of magical thinking, I could get shaktipat just thinking about seeing her speak. Did she in fact speak? Directly to camera? For how long?
No, as shared by others, it is all a kindergarten game. The real thing is wherever you are now, and keeping the lights on inside everyday. May you all have that for 2008 with plenty to share.
P e a c e y'all
Here's some words from the big guy:Buddha Sk.
"Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense."
"work out your own salvation. Do not depend on others"
buddha/saky.
"work out your own salvation. Do not depend on others"
buddha/saky.
January 2, 2008 2:07 PM
Thank you for this motto for the new year. Will repeat it, and on good authority.
This is FASCINATING to me - I haven't participated in SY since 2003. No dramatic exit - just sort of...stopped. Then I stumbled upon leavingsiddhayoga.com and message boards like this one and it is so interesting to me to hear everyone speaking out so openly. When I practiced (1995 - 2003), I was only ever around devotees and no one DARED express doubts or suspicions. If you did, you were "struggling." Huh? Anyway, I've read many books by both Gurumayi and Muktananda (so many I'm shocked in looking back). I don't know exactly how I feel about the whole thing now, but I have a bad taste in my mouth when it comes to the whole exclusivity thing - Gurumayi was still guiding intensives and taking darshan back in the day I first met her, but only the wealthy and uber-devoted and celebrities got close access. To hear she's completely elusive now isn't so shocking. I just wonder what her devotees are chasing - especially the new ones. Without the guru's presence...I don't know. Maybe I never really "got it."
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